Most people want one. Some people don't, for sake of not wanting to add more moving parts to an already complex system. However, AFoxInTheWires and I have brainstormed a bit and have a concept ready to present that seems to be well rounded, simple enough to implement without over-centralizing anything or dissuading new members due to excessive complexity, while at the same time being versatile enough to create a new dynamic in characters.
At the same time, this system would promote Player driven RP, and provide means of furthering character storylines in site-downtime, rather than have things come to a halt if the staff are busy with real-life issues or simply can't devote the necessary time to the MMM (which is totally fine! We all know how life gets)
Without further ado, the proposed MMM Cross System!
Crosses would be a type of Advanced Form, in the same vein of Dark Soul and Hyper Mode.
Crosses consist of a unique Skill that represents the "flavor" of the parent Navi, 1 Attack pulled from the parent Navi's attack pool, and 1 Element level of the highest Element the parent Navi possesses. In case of a tie, the parent Navi can decide what their "main" element is. When in a Cross, your Strengths and Weaknesses are altered appropriately according to the Element you gain from the Cross. Crosses can be used once per battle and last for 1 turn to start. Crosses can be ended earlier if hit by an Attack that the Element gained by the Cross is weak to.
Crosses start at Lv.1, and through repeated use can be leveled up further, to a max of Lv.5, according to the following chart:
When a Cross levels up, you may choose ONE of the following bonuses to apply:
Cross Extend: +1 Turn to Cross Duration Cross Empower: +1 Element level to Cross's Element
There would also most likely be a restriction on how many Crosses a navi could possess. On the other hand, maybe there might be no cap, but only one Cross would be usable per battle, to prevent abuse and over-centralization.
Crosses can be created at any time and are subject to mod approval. Each Navi can only have ONE Cross associated with them, and once approved cannot be changed or edited unless approved by a mod under special circumstances.
One thing AFoxInTheWires suggested could be that a "Parent Navi" could create their Cross at any time, so other people can look them over and see if they want to pursue acquiring your Cross.
Two Navis who are NOT owned by the same person must have participated in 10 RP battles or events with/against each other, each of at least 10 posts in length. Half of those may be stat battles, as long as there are RP elements present.
Once the first step is completed, each of those Navis may create a Custom Story for the other, in which they somehow grant them the use of their Cross. This Custom Story must be at least 20 posts long. Once the Custom Story has been completed, the Navi being trained/gifted gains the Cross of the Custom Story's creator.
The Acquisition Process is lengthy for two reasons. One, so to make Crosses more difficult to obtain, and two, to promote Player RP interaction, creativity, and foster overall growth in regards to RP.
So there you have it! I would like to give a shoutout to AFoxInTheWires for coming up with most of these ideas, as well as writing out the bulk of text here. I admittedly didn't do much, and only offered ideas in terms of balancing.
Comments and Criticisms are welcome and appreciated, if not encouraged. I personally have wanted a Cross System since Battle Network 6, and I'm sure most of you have in some way or another as well. I totally respect the notion of not wanting to over-complicate our quite versatile system, but I would like to see a bit more flavor inspired by the source material and this seems like a great way to do it.
Cross Skill: *Furious Focus* Custom | Passive The user invokes the power of Torihime's fury, powering up their attacks and striking with a vengeance.
Skill Effect: When Kujaku Cross is activated, the user is automatically inflicted with Berserk (ignores Immunity). While under Berserk caused by this effect, the user gets +2 attack slots per turn instead of +1 and counters all attacks against them for 30 counter damage, up to 4 times per turn. Attack slots may be sacrificed to power up the users attacks, up to a maximum of 3 extra attack slots per attack, adding damage equal to 70% of the user's base attack (rounded down to the nearest 5) per attack slot sacrificed.
Bonus Damage per Attack Slot = (70% Base Damage, rounded down to nearest 5)
Cross Attack: *Hummingbird* C-Range | Blade The user summons Torihime's blade, Kujaku, to deliver multiple quick slashes upon the target.
Post by AFoxInTheWires on Feb 8, 2015 16:05:16 GMT -8
I'm thinking that Crosses should only be used once per battle, and then have a Cross Plus program that adds an additional use, with a series of sequential upgrades that allow for more uses, to a total of 3 additional uses.
Seems neat. But to poke a hole (or really, just a question) what about someone like K-414?
His element is custom, and it uses a skill to do so. Would the Cross in question require his skill to give access to that element?
If that's the case, Navi with that specific bend (of which admittedly there aren't many) might have less desireable 'Crosses' than others.
Outside of that, I think it's interesting and would definitely promote RP, without giving those who do powers that they don't need. The other question is-
How many Crosses can you have?
Having multiple (regardless of the work involved) can give said navi an advantage if they are able to adjust which one they're using, based on their opponent.
We'd also need to make sure that they weren't overly powerful, (obviously) as something like Torihime's there would stack in very painful way with a navi that already makes use of the Berserk status offensively, which is something that (normally) wouldn't get approved on that same Navi.
These are all things I've thought of since posting, so allow me to address your concerns!
Navis of this variety would indeed have their Cross operate that way!
Take Starless for example. It's Cross would have it's Cross Skill be the Anti Element Custom Skill, the Cross Element would be Anti. It would likely have an effect that inflicted Anti and/or Denial, and it would be Strong against None and Weak against Everything. Now while I recognize that using Starless Cross would be difficult, it could offer a different sort of power in battles. Being able to shut off your opponent's Element and convert their Attacks to Elementless damage could be useful in a pivotal battle situation.
At the same time, playing into the RP element of Crosses, Starless Cross would play nicely into the RP aspect of the character. Starless is driven to overwrite the code of other navis with that of it's own, thereby multiplying itself and increasing in power. The Starless Cross would be (in my opinion, I recognize the potential bias) a unique kind of stats/roleplay crossover mechanic that is just one of many possible application to character development and storytelling if we implement this system.
I would say if we were to have an upper limit, it would be 5, like in the games. However, I think there should be usage restrictions on them, with no more than one base being usable per battle (which is unlike the games).
I would imagine you could earn more, but once you hit 5, you would have to delete one of your old ones. Later, if you wanted to get that one back, you would have to go through another 20 post Custom Story with that other navi. It wouldn't be a recreation of the previous story, either, as these events would be canon to the characters and foster relationships.
We would definitely need to have a trial period of some kind, even after some think time to the metric for these things. I admit it will be difficult to balance while still presenting a fully formed essence of the navi the Cross bears the name of. Admittedly, I'm not too versed on the in's and out's of Hyper Modes anymore, but it should at least be comparable to them. Bear in mind, these start at 1 Turn duration, base, and only get to level up to Lv5. They can at best have 5 Turn duration, or 5 Element Levels. Since each Cross will specialize differently, some will find Element Levels more preferable than duration, and I think we'll see a balance stabilize.
Those are my responses to your main questions/concerns.
Fair enough. The only difficulty I can foresee is, as mentioned, balancing them, as some are likely just not going to be as effective as others, simply through the way the Navi is designed. This may lead to some Navi being not exactly being seen as 'worthy' or 'usable' for the idea.
Not trying to nay-say, but despite us trying to blend stats and RP, Stats generally comes out on top, and if someone doesn't have an element/skill/attack that someone might find usable, and hence, not really ever be used for the Cross System.
That's pretty much my biggest concern with the system. I like the premise, but it feels like offensive navi will see a bigger use in the cross system than defensive or more support-oriented Navi.
Also, one thing I didn't see (and may have missed) what Version are these skills/attacks set at?
I've been trying to figure out why people don't drive their personal stories to begin with for a long time. It's a mystery that plagues me still. I've always been of the mentality that you shouldn't let getting a toy be the driving force behind your roleplaying. That you should just play your stories out for the fun of it. Maybe that's my issue though. Most gamers tend to act if there's something in it for them beyond the experience. I'm surprised you all haven't been doing more custom story bits in lieu of Ravens AWOL though.
I don't have much to contribute or an official stance on the matter. Just a question of why you two feel this is necessary in order to promote roleplay. Do you only really have the urge if there's a reward? I've been talking to myself about the idea to have each post in story give experience. No scaling for length or anything fancy like that. Would that satisfy the desire?
I digress. This looks like a cleaner version of what Warrior tried to do a few years ago and as said above I'm kinda useless for a 'yay/nay'. Good work though. It wouldn't take much effort to shear it into a functioning system for the site.
": I'm "♥♪!?", but it's hard to pronounce so... call me Geno, after the doll." Gen: All American. The Cobalt Mirage: All the time. Shast: IN AMERICA "They're so far below the understanding of how it could work that it physically hurts me"
Kman: I see where you're coming from and hold some similar concerns, but I think this is an instance of "we'll only really know for sure till we try it." For example, Starless is a hyper offense character, and a defensive navi's cross might be a preferable option in that case.
As far as Version... that's something AFoxInTheWires and I didn't discuss and we would have to have that discussion either as a site or, more likely, as staff if staff decide to implement this. If we do go that far though I'd like to throw my hat into the ring as wanting to be a part of that discussion.
I have too been trying to figure that out. I've got a very long long-game planned out for most of my characters, and the only real reason I haven't been pushing it much recently is because of school. Also, with things like notegg's various side-stories (<HUB> and <PET>) and Blues's Subterfuge Tower, (not to mention Phreezey Breeze, it seems like he's created more custom stories than anyone else) we're already seeing some outside-of-main-story RP without any toy being the driving force. Admittedly, encore's staff but the essence of these stories is what is fun and interesting to me.
That said, I also recognize that when playing games players do like to have toys, and this could offer incentive to players to follow the lead of others and play around with RP aspects of the site.
Each post in story granting experience would be an interesting path to take... My only worry there is that we would start to see people posting excessively or worse, needlessly, to get that bit of experience they need. With the Cross System, while people might start out doing it for the toy, when it's all said and done they would have developed a relationship with another character that could have real impacts on story, the way the character is played, their relationships with other characters, etc. To me it feels much more dynamic.
Post by AFoxInTheWires on Feb 9, 2015 8:30:46 GMT -8
Please allow me to clarify a few things. I know I'm new here and don't have much clout, but I do have a few things to say in regards to the points some of you have brought up.
Shast : As far as the "toy" thing, well... even in my short time here, a LOT of people have been wanting a Crossy System. Since they are one of the coolest parts of the game (in my opinion, being a versatility/strategy type), I was actually surprised to find there wasn't one in place already. I also heard many people lamenting the fact that RP was taking a backseat to stats in many ways, and I thought that I might be able to help address both issues at once. The idea, on my end, wasn't to tease or coerce people into RP just for the "toy". The way I saw it was that from one angle, you are encouraging people who like stats to jump more into RP and make some connections on the site and potential learn the joys of communal storytelling, and from another angle you are also rewarding those who already DO lots of RP by giving them a solid stat toy to play with. I feel like it benefits everyone, and gives us something fun to play with. Does that make sense?
Kman : As far as power goes, in my head it was all about synergy. Some Crosses may seem strong or weak, but that is (at least, it should be) in relation to the Navi using it. A highly offensive Navi probably wouldn't benefit from another offensive Cross because the Cross won't likely add much (if any) power to their attacks, and if it does it would only be for a very brief time. What I see is that Crosses are a strategic choice, rather than a brute force one. I think it's a great way to add versatility to a Navi. For instance, Torihime's Kujaku Cross would definitely seem very strong in the hands of someone who utilizes Berserk as well, but very weak in others who may not like that aspect of it. Even a very strong glass-cannon Navi would be wary of using it because of the huge damage they would take while Berserk. The Crosses represent the essence of a Navi, and I'd like to think should represent their personality a little bit. And just like some Navis will have more synergy with some that with others, some Crosses will just work better with some Navis than others. But that's all part of it If we institute a limit on crosses as per earlier posts, then people would have to think more carefully about what they Crosses they choose to pursue. And I honestly don't see people picking Crosses JUST for the power. It may be a factor, and there's nothing wrong with that, but I think we'll see a lot more of people choosing Crosses for RP purposes, to signify time spent playing with friends. And even IF the power is the driving force for some, they will mostly likely make friends on the road to getting the Cross, and I think that's a good thing.
In regards to the Version of skills/attacks, one of my first ideas for Crosses was that they should be Version-independant. You should be able to make them at V1. If you notice on the example I provided of Torihime's Kujaku Cross, any mentions of stats are in relation to the Navi that owns the cross, and not Stats from Torihime herself. And I think that's how it needs to be. It gives the Crosses way more versatility and utility than just slapping a skill/attack on verbatim. Yes, Navi's get more skills/attacks/overall power as they Version-Up, but this should be independant of the Cross. RP-wise, I think Crosses should take a significant amount of power to use, because you are essentially merging your code with that of another Navi for a short time. You are not going to be both Navi's at once. You are going to be you with a dash of someone else. That being the case, basing the Cross on the skills and attacks you have at V1 is both balancing and reasonable. With Kujaku Cross, the extra attack slots and the ability to power up your attacks will always be useful, from V1 to V-Whatever-Max-Version-Is, and even for a more passive or support Navi, Hummingbird can be a powerful attack that can turn the tide of battle, and a support Navi can easily heal the damage they take from the Berserk while in Cross. So when designing Crosses, you should pull from what you had available at V1, and give the flavor of your Navi, while leaving anything derived from stats as dependent on the Navi using it. And the max level and multiple upgrade option for Crosses was meant to add to that. With Kujaku Cross, one might find extending the duration either very beneficial or very harmful, where as increasing the element level either very useful or near useless (it would be good if you're Navi already uses a lot of counters). In Torihime's case, Blade Element isn't very strong when it comes to the effects you get from it, but it will be different with others. Wood Crosses and Elec Crosses will probably make people have to think really hard about how they upgrade it. But another part of the fun is that if 2 Navis have the same Cross, how they level it up and under what circumstances they use it may be completely different, and that's awesome.
Yeah, I know I ramble a lot. But, I hope I answered some questions. :)
Mirror your last paragraph could flip 'exp per post' and 'cross system' and be just as accurate. Given the lengthy requirements of crosses that could result in just as many filler posts! Maybe even mooore.
Fox you answered my question on point.
Stats often takes a backseat to Roleplay because well... The stats staff is more active. I entertain myself in the mechanics of story balance sometimes but I'm by no means the final say. People don't do much on their own in story so I don't really toss out GMD's either. It's near the top of my priorities, even though it's not directly my job for it to be.
I am also aware of the peoples lust but if everything was added that a mass wanted then we'd have too much. It's a careful matter of weighing a myriad of factors to get something implemented. In any game really, haha. Does it mesh well? How complex is it(Too simple even)? Does it punish people who -don't- participate too hard to say it's optional? The list goes on. No need to justify the suggestion from this last bit. It's just my rambling.
Oh, and completely off topic Fox but saves me time. Smart move just throwing up a concepts bit. I keep mine in notepad. Toying around with makin navis is oodles of fun. Arguably more than playing with em since stats keeps having this issue with too many item jacked navis. xD
": I'm "♥♪!?", but it's hard to pronounce so... call me Geno, after the doll." Gen: All American. The Cobalt Mirage: All the time. Shast: IN AMERICA "They're so far below the understanding of how it could work that it physically hurts me"
If people end up abusing systems we can deal with that then. I was just commenting on what I saw as a way for people to nickel and dime their way up a version and my aversion to that.
Of course one could still flip exp per post and cross system so the discussion isn't really going anywhere.
I realize games can't always have what players want (mass just makes me think of some formless blob) but when we're running a game based on a different game, I think it makes sense to incorporate more elements from the source material.
Normally I refrain from forming opinions regarding system changes, as many staff know, and as such some say that I am only interested in stats at my convenience, which is in part true, though I'd like to become more involved in the stats side of things, but I digress. I am a story staff, and crosses fall deeply into the domain of story-mode. As such, I'll try and look at the cross system as objectively as possible. Please keep in mind that I am biased slightly towards saying 'no', due to the potential homogenization of navi concepts, as well as a matter of taste. If I come off as particularly harsh to the concept in places, I must apologize now, as my intentions are to be as objective as possible in my analysis.
Despite my averseness to the MDA framework to game analysis, one of the tools it employs is the 8 types of fun, a simple vocabulary which allows us to begin to describe games from the view of the end user, outside of the mechanics of the game itself.1 With this vocabulary, we can begin to describe the game world with concrete descriptors without going deeply into mechanics. That is, this first pass of analysis will be one of aesthetics, not mechanics. It is an idealistic view, as the MegaMan Melee is very strongly user-oriented, so long as we shy away from getting deeply into mechanics.
Before we look directly at the cross system, I want to look first into the aesthetics of the MegaMan Melee itself, using the eight types of fun listed in the MDA Framework. The MegaMan Melee, at its very core, is two aesthetics: Expression and Fellowship. It is a web site, on the internet2 - an obvious statement but one that is required to really explain why the MegaMan Melee is an experience of Fellowship and Expression. To be more precise, we could say that the MegaMan Melee is a role-playing forum. It is in these two simple words that we find ourselves with an answer as to why the aesthetics of Expression and Fellowship run so strongly through the Melee.
Roleplaying:(Noun) Action in which a person takes on a role (as that of an actor) and pretends or acts out being that character.3
Forum:(Noun)(Internet) An Internet message board where can post messages regarding one or more topics of discussion.4
The concepts of expression is in-built to roleplaying, and discussion in-built to that of a forum. It is a matter of media in why we enjoy our game as we do, and though the Melee fills almost all of the MDA's types of fun, it arguably fills most strongly those that are built into the medium itself.
Looking then, into the Cross system it is an example of a strong, simplified state-changing mechanic. Everything is organized into easily digestible parts, and it is a very well designed mechanic in this sense. For us to analyze more deeply the mechanic, we must then break it into its smaller defined parts - which is comparable to a linear ascension, flat-line, and descent (Figure 1).
The first mechanic that is witnessed by the player is not the first mechanic listed - it is before the cross system is even created or lusted for - it is the pre-creation, the wanting of a cross, or the wanting to create a cross. We put up on a pedestal, a most powerful transformation, obtainable only through fellowship with another. The cross' sole existence, even before looking into the nitty-gritty of the details, creates strong Fantasy and Fellowship aesthetics, with the creation of a cross generating Expression aesthetics. With these suppositions, it is clear why crosses are so strongly requested a feature - their core aesthetics match up perfectly with the aesthetics of the site itself, whilst adding a strong dose of fantasy. Before even looking towards Mirror and Foxy's build of the system, we can see it would mesh well with our site from the outset - in theory.
Chronologically, our next objective is to obtain a cross. This is pretty obviously a task of coordination and diligence, one that requires both the cooperation of people and their characters. This is aesthetically, a Narrative and a Fellowship - a dramatic cooperation. These aesthetics match perfectly what is going on in the narrative, whilst also providing a Challenge. This suits the game nature of the MegaMan Melee, and provides the narrative content which comprises crosses.
To obtain a cross one must be first built. We boil down the core of our navis into a useable bonus, the very soul of our navi given to those with whom we share many memories - in essence becoming one of soul. Narratively, very pretty, but aesthetically it's a matter of Expression as well as a Challenge, we seek to create the right set of stats, the right type of strategy to give to our allies. Given the difficulty of this whole ordeal, and it's length, is arguable that the system provides us Submission - a past-time. It is this mixture of Submission that puts our initial foray into Crosses at odds with its intent. At which point does Submission become tedium? In our mechanical design, we must err on the side of caution to ensure a balance between the other aesthetes, such that they remain the primary enjoyments of the activity.
Now we reach the climax of our activity, the obtaining of the cross itself. After all of our hard work and camaraderie, we have obtained one of the most powerful tools at our disposal, the power of friendship! In all seriousness, the peak of our enjoyment is the battle immediately following the acquisition of a cross. We experiment with new strategies, new techniques, and we do so with the benefits of a powerful ally - sharing in the experiences and experimentation. Again, Expression and Fellowship enters the limelight. The system achieves what it sets out to do.
However, what comes after? Slowly our interest in the system wanes. Though we receive the occasional boost, the cross we have obtained is reduced to another tool in the shed - which is actually what makes sense. An omni-tool is not as good as a full tool box5, and our cross shouldn't be an omni-tool. Even still, the development of a cross after the fact grants an amount of Submission without Difficulty - which is why it doesn't become tedium, but rather a sort of pastime or addition to the existent growth system.
In essence, your system works aesthetically. The player experience would - theoretically - feel great. But the MegaMan Melee isn't just aesthetic. In order to really look at adding a new system, we need to look at it as a mechanical vector in addition to its aesthetic factor. In this case, your suggestions are aesthetically sound, and well designed, but as a mechanical vector, there is much balancing left to be desired - especially in the interaction with the site’s ecosystem. To add a new mechanic, we need to consider what it affects, in terms of growth and power potential, as well as what is needed to support such a system, and whether or not the system is viable on its own.
The Cross System is weakly supported by the existing growth system. Everything innate to growth in the MegaMan Melee is based upon either Experience or Zenny, with BugFrags being an exception - and truthfully, not a growth system at all. To compare crosses to BugFrags is probably the best method of comparison. BugFrags exist as an isolate mechanic, a lone bonus system that provides one with certain benefits upon achieving difficult tasks. Crosses are, on the other hand, a driving force for some roleplaying. Roleplaying already provides a generally higher rewards gains, and encouraging ten-battle-long threads of RP battle will cause an inflation in Versions and Zenny, at a rate that is potentially upsetting to the game’s current ecosystem.6 While we have no issues with people going for Versions quickly, we do like to refrain from giving them too much opportunity, or incentive, as doing such creates a dry spell - making it difficult for newer members to enter the game. To contrast, BugFrags rarely cause a large influx of Experience upon their acquisition, and even if some do, it is not to a degree that is so large or repeatable. The issue comes that we are not only rewarding the player, but we are over-rewarding them.
This comes to the second issue with your current iteration of Crosses. In order to gain one you’d need to make 120 posts. That’s a huge amount of posts - more posts than Foxy currently has doing other business - much too high of a difficulty when absenteeism and delays are commonplace in the lives of many players - this is a simple matter of fact - one that can’t be avoided. However, I do believe your assessment that the difficulty required to obtain a cross must be high is correct, as it provides part of the core aesthetic, but rarity to obtain is not a vector we can balance against as staff.7 Sadly, this is where the difficulty in story-mode balancing becomes complicated. As story staff, we have less raw numbers to run with, and even less to even play with. I highly suggest you rethink your difficulties, not in numeric terms, but look at incomparables that we can use in story mode. Incomparables being non-numeric mechanics that can be pieced together while being non-numeric - such as statuses on attacks. Perhaps a focus on a certain element of style or development as a writer must be emphasized? A thought.
In terms of power potential, crosses upset almost everything - there is no benefit to not choosing a cross, and this causes the potential homogenization of stats, as most players will either be taking the strongest crosses or making the strongest cross - that is, if they were freely available. As they are not as freely available, it balances out - in time - but not in power. I want you two to think on this one, as your current method grants almost raw stats, while shafting soloists.8 Combined with as small an advantage as initiative, a user with crosses would definitely win - a reward not for strategy but for simply owning an advantage. You can argue the same for programs, but programs follow a strongly moderated growth curve, that’s been relatively unchanged for almost five years now. A change that may balance this is classifying crosses as a special form of chip, likely Giga - solving your issues of potential collection and abuse as well as providing a real choice and trade off in terms of grabbing a powerful solo-giga or getting an equally strong cross. It is also noticeable that a skill, an attack and an element is a very heavy bonus, and your mastery system only further enhances these bonuses. You should probably tune this back, lest it get too powerful. Normally the judge is always out on crossing of skills, as one skill on one navi can have very different and unforeseen consequences given the context of another navi.9 In the context of your crosses however, I think an exception can be made, especially should it utilize a giga chip slot. Keeping in mind that this may also lead into restrictive moderation of crosses, just to err on the side of caution.
Now for the real question, can the mechanic stand alone? Does it deeply affect or change the experience for a fresh member or a new navi? I think the answer to the first is a definite yes. As it stands, the mechanic is wll thought out, but seriously lacking in balance and in need of some tuning. Does it change the experience of a new player or navi? For once, I feel that I can say, "yes definitely", as a positive response to this question. The aesthetics of crosses, taking away the mechanics, are purely positive - the strengthening of fraternity between our members is an excellent goal, and crosses are an excellent mechanical representation of this goal. However, though the larger mechanic is strong, it's independent vectors of design, the smaller states which compose the larger mechanic, needs to be reviewed for a second pass. The questions of support from within and without the system needs to be reviewed - do we create new accessories as support? As well as the system's precariously high barrier to entry.
I am not a ludologist, and I am very barely staff. My words are not final, nor are they charged with any kind of emotion. I attempted to look at the question of crosses as objectively as possible, though I know that there exists some matter of bias from within the subconscious written word of this post. Please do not take any criticisms personally, as they are simply my arguments, and carry no form of malice. I like the system you suggested, but it definitely needs some tweaks before release. These tweaks needn't be numerical, either, I heavily suggest the brainstorming of incomparable challenges, as story is in itself an incomparable factor of statistics - try as we may to pin factors on things in a certain way.
Your system, ultimately, is aesthetically strong, but mechanically weak, and not in the sense of power. The particular imbalance of strengths to difficulties is particularly odd, perhaps reducible by at least half. Without a doubt your proposed system captures the spirit of the MMM, but introduces too many elements of imbalance to enter into the current ecosystem of the game.
Notes: 1. MDA: A Formal Approach to Game Design and Game Research. Robin Hunicke, Marc Leblanc, Robert Zubeck. An archival of <http://www.cs.northwestern.edu/~hunicke/MDA.pdf> dated 2015-Feb-03. 2. This is the internet, by the way. 3. Wiktionary, retrieved 2015-Feb-10. 4. Ibid. 5. Ask any programmer. Or mechanic. Or admin. 6.Despite the lower entry experience, at ten posts you'd be looking at 100/1000 exp/zenny on win, before grading and bonuses.
A snippet, taken out of context but with it's meaning still applicable. 8. Believe me, the urge to make the pun 'Shasting', was resisted with heavy contemplation and regret. 9. Anacrusis. Toxin. Retrieved 10-Feb-2015. Get rekt.
Post by ~Divine|<3|Heart~ on Feb 11, 2015 7:53:07 GMT -8
I don’t have time for pretty borders.
I’ve tried to keep myself from weighing in because: 1) I don’t want to end up adding Megami’s Double Soul mechanics to this system. 2.) No chance of bias. 3.) I’m not sure if I am still viable to dabble in making systems: but there are concerns about this Cross System, especially the design that I wanted to address.
To cut corners and start: it bothers me (refer to number 2) mostly because It’s very complex for something simple added. The moment I was reading the first post, I was going: sure okay...eh...a little iffy. Then when I got to the parent NetNavi explanation, I vomited rainbows. Mostly, I think it’s your delivery that’s bothering me and I can understand you are trying to express everyone’s NetNavi on the site in a nice unison with your own, but the fact of the matter is there is a lot of brokenness on the site because of expression going a little too far.
Trust me, I know considering I probably add to it, even if just a little.
My thoughts on this? If you really want to do a Cross System, I think it should be very story-oriented considering the nature of it in MMBN VG series canon, and also it should be something that benefit the melee and give reasoning for in-depth character interaction. So far, you guys all have been relying on moderation for story, especially in main, which is cool and all...but my years roleplaying on literate RP forums not only turned me into a multi-para typing nazi, but taught me that the fun is when we have some wacky ideas, RP scenarios, and depth story that is building up to a wonderful climax.
Which is why I think “Levels” in Cross Systems should be expressed through something aside with Karma: Xros Karma or something like that (Range 0-300). Lv.1 (50-149) / Lv.2 (150-299) / Lv.3 (300) - Reasoning? I’m bored. As a Roleplay Rewards Mod, I see a lot of developing relationships lately, to some extent, but yet I cannot even grade or hand out anything but Zenny/XP. I think the Zenny/XP system is being used for so many reasons (On another subject, why can’t I award Karma right now)? I think a good way to get the attention of RP Mods/RP Rewards Mods is too have them reward RPers based on relationships and RPing using story-based items.
The suggested system above goes like this: You will not get a “Cross” until 50 X-Karma. At which point, it will level up until Lv. 3. Why three? Well, it has to do something about the next part I’m about to explain.
...that being I think your system is to...well...free-based. Less automated.
I know this system wants to express NetNavis, but as said before, I think we have a “little” too much expression. Plus, there was something that Encore mentioned that got my attention. This system adds a little lot to the stats plain, so I think working it into stats, forcing it in like an extra piece of meat into a grinder is a better way to go about things rather than trying to make a whole nother’ sausage to choke down. So, chopping up Fox’s template here – the Cross System (IMO) should be based on these variables:
NetNavi Type – Your NetNavi gets certain bonuses depending on the Type of the NetNavi they are crossing with. My suggestions being these and for the following reasons for each effect:
Normal – Basically a jack of all trades, right? Normal-Type crosses allow for adaptation to many situations. Effect: +1 to Cross Limit.
Attack – Deal with unbelievable attack strength. Allows NetNavis to overwhelm opponents with fire power. Effect: +20 DMG to all attacks
Defense – Can hold their own against powerful attacks. Any Crossed NetNavi can take on a little more damage than usual. Effect: +20 Armor against all attacks.
Recon – Speedy NetNavis that can quickly respond to attacks. They can respond more easily to offensive strikes. Effect: -2 Natural Avoid CD applied (Once Per Turn)
Support – NetNavis with healing abilities. They can recover throughout battle quite easily. Effect: +50 Regen Per Turn
Intelligence – NetNavis who are very analytical. They can interpret moves a little bit better and counter attack. Effect: +Add an Omni-Aimer to an attack (Once Per Turn)
Resource – NetNavis who are able to be very resourceful when it comes to selecting their chips. They don’t squander! Effect: NetNavi does not lose a Battle chip use when engaging the corresponding Type’s Cross.
The effects are simplistic and express the NetNavi to not make the system too complicated. I think it’s proper considering all that this system offers.
Now, as for Elements? That’s all you acquire...an element. You would get one element corresponding to that NetNavi and all its strengths and weaknesses. If you a Normal-Element...then I guess you select a set of Weaknesses and Strengths from one other element. It won’t be a Cross System if you had no weaknesses, right?
Cross Skills...I think can do with some tweaking. A lot actually.
There is very few cases of NetNavis using another NetNavi’s skills and attacks. That instance’s name is “Unity” and he has to sacrifice his whole being in battle in order to make a unison. So, having a NetNavi whose attack and skills be totally combinable with a NetNavi is just very slim chance. So, my suggestion? Select one skill according to the NetNavi. We’re going to use Torihime’s skill which is Lark (Active - Dodge). Reason? Because I don’t think Cross System should use Custom Skills. If anything, it kind of ruins the point of having a “Custom Skill” that being they are special to only one NetNavi. Also, this simplifies things.
Selecting the Name of a skill, description, and it’s ability (Down to the simplest elements) allow its use in the plain of stats and story. In other words, if that skill dodges three attacks? It will only dodge one. That’s it. If the skill grants +30 Damage plus additional for certain conditions? It’s only going to grant 30.
Now, for attacks? I think the “Attack” should be corresponding to three and only THREE Navi Chip that is made by the parent NetNavi and is able to be used at least once per turn. If it has CD, then it can’t be used for Cross. If it would be used for a Cross, then it will be scaled accordingly.
Once Per Turn use – Lv.1 Cross (Attack (Base Mega-Chip Damage) One Omni-aimer OR Two-Aimers) 1-Turn CD – Lv.2 Cross (Attack (Base Mega-Chip Damage) One Omni-aimer & Augmented Effect OR Two-Aimers & Augmented Affect) 2-Turn CD – Lv.3 Cross (Attack (Base Mega-Chip Damage) One Omni-aimer, Augmented Effect, & Advanced Effect OR Two-Aimers, Augmented Effect & Advanced Effect)
Simplest form: Your cross Level will determine what that cross can use as attacks at that time.
Now for the “Cross Limit.” I will explain that.
Mostly, I think the leveling up is a good idea. However, the Cross Empower thing I think is a little “out there.” Which is why I think “Cross Limits” are more proper. Cross Limits are the number of times you can use a skill per turn. Upon your Cross gaining a level, so does it also gain a Cross Limit use OR a +1 turn duration. So, instead of using that one skill once, you can use its skills up to three times (Since levls do not go above three). This way, this keeps things nice and simple without going...overboard.
With Cross System expressed like this, this makes generating a Cross very easy. The benefits are still there, even if small: you get to change your element with strengths and weaknesses to suit the situation, you gain a skill, you gain a special Type-characteristic, and you gain an attack in your repertoire even if temporary. So that template Fox had ends up looking like this...
Notice how simplistic it is. Also, with the way this system expresses itself, it’s easy to generate a Cross with simple rules to go by. The only thing you, Parent Navi owner has to do, is make a corresponding chip that is approved by Stat Mods (which we have loads of) and Roleplay with other NetNavis who will gain Cross Karma (as deemed by story mods). As this is a simple system, this can even be posted as a little note in your profile for people to know what the “Cross Stats” are for that NetNavi. It’ll be like going through everyone’s profile, get to know that NetNavi and see what skills items they have to offer.
However, it’s up to that player to give you their cross or not because not everyone will bond with that NetNavi. Also, you can’t participate in the Cross System if you do not make Cross Stats (it’s only fair In my opinion).
Also, activating a Cross costs a Mega-Chip use...which is fair. You cannot activate this ability without any Mega-Chip uses left (even if Resource-Type is the Cross in question). You can only activate these during the Set-up Phase. Crosses are deactivate and depleted when hit by a corresponding element they have a weakness to.
I'm at school so replying from mobile, just want to get some preliminary thoughts out there and I'll develop them more later.
I really like most of what you've done there ~Divine|<3|Heart~, but my thoughts about developing would include making the system more accessible to heavily custom navis. Take Starless for example. There's good story reason for others to get Starless Cross at some point, but with this system Starless has no incentive to use the system because it fails to capture the characters essence, in my opinion. I want to find a way to make it as streamlined as you have, while also being all inclusive.